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Apology to the CSF and CakeDC

Posted on 11/2/10 by Felix Geisendörfer

After our previous post, we are very happy to announce our formal apology to the CakeDC and the Cake Software Foundation.

After further discussions with the CSF we have come to understand why the CSF needs to have an agreement with the venue, this is required to free the funds for making this transaction since the CSF would be legally responsible for the payment. Larry E. Masters has helped us to work out all misunderstandings in that regard, and we would also like to formally apologize to him.

Beyond that, we are also apologizing to the CakePHP community, for jumping the gun early, and having caused damage to the image of the project. This was not our intention, and we only did that, as a last resort to see the venue paid and defending our business from harm.

As previously announced, we are still planning on being valuable members to the community, releasing plugins & components as open source.

We are grateful to all those who donated, and will reimburse everybody completely once the venue has been paid in full, or in no longer than 60 days from the time of your donation, whichever comes first. We will take down the pledgie site also. Until then we will continue to pay the venue 500 EUR / month, so that any eventual delays will not be to their disadvantage. We also had a misunderstanding with the agreement Larry E. Masters had made to personally cover the 500 EUR / month while the CSF was trying to clear up the situation with the 501(c)(3) status. He also clarified, that the CSF is an independent entity from the CakeDC with its own board of directors which currently hold these positions temporarily and that a new board will be in place when all of this legal stuff is completed.

Please, do not let any of this reflect on your opinion about the framework. Every community has their difficult moments, and the CakePHP community has just shown how strong it is, and that all parties are willing to cooperate for its prosperous future without leaving any hard feelings behind.

Sincerely Yours,

Felix Geisendörfer, Director
Tim Koschützki, Director


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Nate Abele said on Feb 11, 2010:


I'm so glad the community was able to help you get this resolved quickly, after all the waiting. Please let us know as soon as the venue is actually paid off, so we can stop holding our collective breath. ;-)

Garrett Woodworth  said on Feb 11, 2010:

Great news. I think this truly shows the power of the community. Does anyone remember the tea party in America or storming the Bastille in France? Please update us as the resolution moves forward.

Thanks again for all your hard work and honesty.

Felix Geisendörfer said on Feb 11, 2010:

Thanks for the support guys. It is very unfortunate how a series of misunderstandings have caused this whole issue to be delayed for such a long time, but it feels very good to see it cleared up now.

Renan Gonçalves said on Feb 11, 2010:

Nice to see people who was enjoying the situation of cakephp venue payment getting a slap on the face.

I'm glad the situation and the misunderstanding was resolved.

See you guys!

Brian Dailey said on Feb 11, 2010:

Glad to see it's all cleared up. Thanks for the prompt update.

Eduardo Romero  said on Feb 11, 2010:

I'm glad everything worked out fine for everybody :) That indeed makes us all feel more comfy as the CakePHP community.

stylish  said on Feb 11, 2010:


Was this something that happened because of public pressure or was this information communicated previously and just misunderstood?

Jeff Loiselle  said on Feb 11, 2010:

Interesting that the CSF had enough legal status to receive funds but not remit them. I wouldn't have even issued an apology. It seems some people are only motivated by fear. At least you scared honesty into them. You all had months to talk about this. Exactly why didn't anything ever come of it until now? Oh right.

Joaquin Windmuller said on Feb 11, 2010:

So, see you in the next CakeFest :)

Felix Geisendörfer said on Feb 11, 2010:

Guys, I understand there are more questions. But we won't comment on these. Mistakes were made on both sides, and we got them resolved. Let's move on : )

Travis  said on Feb 11, 2010:

Felix (and the rest of the Cake team),

I'm glad you and the CSF worked out your differences. Based on the comments above, I think everyone is pretty happy.

It's also really cool that the community got together and was able to raise (some) money. Even though I haven't attended any Cake fests, I still contributed because I felt it would help the project. So, please take my 15 euros and put it towards cake in the future (I was one of the anon donors).

However, after following this drama and discussing with my business partners, we have decided to no longer develop in Cake. In part, this is because we're moving past the rapid prototyping phase, and need something with a little more focus on performance. However, the clear instability of the CSF and the conflicts between the high profile members of the community have forced us to look to more stable pastures.

Which framework are we going to go with? To be honest, I don't know right now. With the unease I feel from this debacle, the idea of a corporate overlord sounds comforting, for once.

Just wanted to let you know that this problem has caused a wavering of confidence in the project. At least for me, and for my company.

Good luck in the future.


Drum  said on Feb 11, 2010:

Sorry for your lost Travis...

Jeff Loiselle  said on Feb 11, 2010:

Hey Travis, remember when Hotmail forgot to renew their domain? Or when Microsoft was getting sued? Did you stop using Microsoft products, I doubt it. Shit happens, and sometimes laundry gets aired publicly.

Mariano Iglesias said on Feb 11, 2010:

The problem is that there are far too many people saying how people that *are part* of an open source team should behave.

It looks real easy from the outside, don't it? Tell you what. Start an open source project. Ask some people to join you. Then try to make a decision that fits everybody's needs. Have fun!

If your confidence in an open source project is based on administrative differences, then I feel sorry for your company, because you are taking the wrong road, because of wrong reasons.

Tim Koschützki said on Feb 11, 2010:

Mariano Iglesias: Exactly.

Travis: Choose your framework based on which problems it solves for you, not because of administration behind it.

Stefan  said on Feb 11, 2010:

Dear Felix,

I'm really pleased to read this post.

I'm very glad that the issue took such a good outcome. And it really shows "how strong it [the CakePHP community] is, and that all parties are willing to cooperate for its prosperous future" as you point it in your own good words. I'm glad to see that the venue will be payed with probably no final lost to your company; that (as I understand it) Larry E. Masters' "you will hear from our lawyers" was not a threat, but meant, and then rendedered to be a helpful clarification; that regardless / before the situation had cleared so many people had donated so much money, (and so many names of great Cake fame in the list ), ...

I must confess that the starting post (The High Cost of Open Source) indeed raised a negative tone or expection regarding the state of organisation, and possibly further management / directions, of CakePHP with me, since the project as a whole seems to have relatively much to do (now) with it's foundation / backing company. And very probably I'm a little bit oversensible regarding such topics due to all the more or less recent changes in core team and organisation sturcture, incl. changes in repository and version numbering and so on... All that resolved so far to being OK or even good, nevertheless! Anyway, it maked me a little more alert maybe -- because I LIKE CakePHP SO MUCH, I think :) Sometimes, love can hurt a little..

I would like to afterwards encourage you for having written both of the posts, the problem one and now the "apology". A community is a live thing, as in real life. Errors and misunderstandings are human as such. Being able to solving them is a remarkable strength.

Kind regards

AxlF  said on Feb 11, 2010:

Dear Felix and Tim,

I'm very happy to hear that this problem isn't further a problem!

For me and my work, i will definitely stay with cakephp. Now more than ever. This issue showed me that there is a strong community behind the software we all love! And I'm really happy to see that even money problems could be solved in a fair and adult manner.

This is the evidence for me that the project cakephp has the strength to handle such difficult problems, and that it is worth spending more time with the framework and its community!

Wintry greetings from Hannover,

Arnold Almeida  said on Feb 12, 2010:

Glad this is cleared up.

With love from down under,


Jedt  said on Feb 12, 2010:

Everyone! Community hug!!

I'm now even prouder being a baker.


Tarique Sani said on Feb 12, 2010:

+1 Everyone! Community hug!! Am glad this is resolved.

Mariano Iglesias said on Feb 12, 2010:

Or like Matt says, let's all have awesome internet make up sex

hussein harake (Robust Solution) said on Feb 12, 2010:

You have a real brave heart to apologize to the king Larry. The man who takes a big project on his own then exposed it to the public under the MIT license is not selfish or arrogant... he may be crazy... but he is generous for sure.

Just remember that CakePHP unifies everyone of us.

All my respect.

SayB said on Feb 15, 2010:

lol ! ... @mariano I'm so tweeting this: "Or like Matt says, let's all have awesome internet make up sex" !

Kudos guys ! ... it's all for the love of Cake :P

Vasken said on Feb 24, 2010:

Sweet! everything's peachy again! Let's get started on CakeFest 2010!

Too soon?

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